Translation of word "din" into "doctrine"?

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GodGuides4:175

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Im trying to sort through why the word "doctrine" was chosen for Arabic word din in Sam's translation. It seems the word has a more broad meaning. And from what I can study with lexicon the Arabic word "qawl" used in Quran has the meaning of "doctrine". So why is din translated as doctrine when there is a very specific word for doctrine and that translation choice seems very narrow meaning for the words scope and I find no lexicon or dictionary support for this.

I'm asking especially because it does give a different focus on the mind/doctrine/intellect instead of focus on practical way of life/character/deeds...which is a big difference.
 
Laleh Bakhtiar, In her translation of The Quran translates the verse 2:256 ‘There is no compulsion in the way of life.’

The clear Quran, Majestic Quran and Asad all translate it as ‘There is no compulsion in religion’

Sam Gerrans translates it as ‘doctrine’

3:19 Gerrans, The doctrine with God is submission

Layla Bakhtiar Sublime Quran,
3:19 Truly the way of life with God is submission to the one God.

Asad 3:19 (19) Behold, the only [true] religion in the sight of God is [man’s] self-surrender unto Him;

It’s interesting that most translations use the word ‘religion’ but The Sublime translates that as ‘way of life’ and Gerrans ‘doctrine’

It reminds me of The Biblical translations and how a verse can change depending on its translation
In those two instances I definitely think that the translation of din to ‘religion’ is a mistake. I prefer Layla and Gerrans translation. Islam is not a new religion, it is submission to God. Doctrine can be a way of following life but with an emphasis on spirituality.
 
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saidmirza said:
Peace,

Here is a search of this word across the entire Qur'an.

The Qur'an: A Complete Revelation

reader.quranite.com reader.quranite.com

Of interest will be 12:76 where this word is used for the Law of the King in Yusuf's time.
Click to expand...
Thank you and peace to you brother

Honestly when I consider 12:76 "doctrine" reads confusing and rough/awkward to me in Sam's translation. (I don't mean this insulting)

I understand din can be "law" and is combined with other words to be speaking of Gods divine law and judgement day ect...

But when I think of doctrine I think of this narrow definition as a religious/political set of beliefs held or taught. (Per definition this is something predominately contained in the intellect and not encompassing meaning of a way of life/character/deeds.)

Lord willing I will take time to read each reference in context and think about this more.

I guess Im cautious because seems there is a more clear word for "doctrine" and if Allah choose din instead of qawl I want to be careful about my understanding with this...

What do you think about the word "qawl" in the Quran?
 
@Uncovered Faith

Great points sister and I appreciate your points to help me think through all this more!

I will try to explain my understanding about this better:

Doctrine by definition is my beliefs (what is going on in my mind) that has overlap in that doctrine can influence my actions/way of life/deeds. But these are separate and not to be conflated together.

Another example: Hypocrite is one who per his "doctrine" believes/claims belief to something but his deen/way of life is contrary.

So I think of qawl is my thoughts/doctrine that impacts my din/way of life

And in regards to the other translations you sited who chose "Religion" from my understanding of the standard definitions of words... religion can be combination of actions not just beliefs. (Intellect and way of life) So I don't understand "religion" to be as exclusive as "doctrine" would be. Though I don't care for the translation choice of "religion" for that very reason that I think we tend to think of primary as doctrines.

But typically in religious context it would be understood that when we speak of religion it encompasses something way more than just intellect/doctrines.
 
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GodGuides4:175 said:
Thank you and peace to you brother

Honestly when I consider 12:76 "doctrine" reads confusing and rough/awkward to me in Sam's translation. (I don't mean this insulting)

I understand din can be "law" and is combined with other words to be speaking of Gods divine law and judgement day ect...

But when I think of doctrine I think of this narrow definition as a religious/political set of beliefs held or taught. (Per definition this is something predominately contained in the intellect and not encompassing meaning of a way of life/character/deeds.)

Lord willing I will take time to read each reference in context and think about this more.

I guess Im cautious because seems there is a more clear word for "doctrine" and if Allah choose din instead of qawl I want to be careful about my understanding with this...

What do you think about the word "qawl" in the Quran?
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In Asad’s translation 12:76 reads,
In this way did We contrive for Joseph [the attainment of his heart’s desire]: under the King’s law, he would [otherwise] not have been able to detain his brother, had not God so willed. We do raise to [high] degrees [of knowledge] whomever We will – but above everyone who is endowed with knowledge there is One who knows all.1715

So basically he translates it as ‘law’ rather than Gerrans ‘doctrine’

I understand what you are saying. If there is an Arabic word for Doctrine then why does Allah use Din? Is law the same as doctrine?
 
Uncovered Faith said:
In Asad’s translation 12:76 reads,
In this way did We contrive for Joseph [the attainment of his heart’s desire]: under the King’s law, he would [otherwise] not have been able to detain his brother, had not God so willed. We do raise to [high] degrees [of knowledge] whomever We will – but above everyone who is endowed with knowledge there is One who knows all.1715

So basically he translates it as ‘law’ rather than Gerrans ‘doctrine’

I understand what you are saying. If there is an Arabic word for Doctrine then why does Allah use Din? Is law the same as doctrine?
Click to expand...

Right I'm trying to understand din and its translation as "law" and how that could relate...

Im hopeful someone knowledgeable in Arabic (and patient lol) can help explain this in a way I can understand.

Im guessing there is a nuance for when din is understood to be law vs way of life and how that relates to the word qawl and how these are used in Arabic and how it could be most accurate to translate din in all those times as doctrine.
 
More translations!
Arberry says 12:76
So we contrived for Joseph’s sake; he could not have taken his brother, according to the king’s doom, except that God willed.

That sounds completely odd to me! (Doom)

Sublime Quran 12:76
We contrived for Joseph. He would not have taken his brother into the judgement of the king unless God wills it.

So here she translated din as judgement. It’s very confusing. Arabic speakers don’t even seem to be United in their translations. Let me check her concordance for Judgement…..

Ok, in The Sublime Quran concordance this is what it says about the word DIN

Din is a masculine noun …. Just due, way of life, yawm Al din Day of Judgement.
1:4 one who is sovereign of the day of judgement
2:193 there be no persecution and the way of life
12:76 He takes not his brother in to the judgement
24:2 For them take you from the judgement of God
37:20 Woe to us! This is the day of judgment
39:2 who is sincere and devoted in the way of life
42:13 perform the prescribed way of life
74:46 had been denying the day of judgment
98:5 That is the truth loving way of life
110:2 humanity entering into the way of life of God

There are many more. Way of life and judgement are the two translations throughout

DANA - verb I perfect - To practice a way of life
Verb I imperfect YADINU - to practice a way of life
Verb I passive participle (MADIN) one who is judged
 
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